For example, having your landing gears located near the ends of the wings is an easy way to ensure that you don't roll and shred your wings when landing or taking off. "Type E" is the smallest you should have, and you want a set of those connected at the back of the fuselage. Do agree that the rear wheels either need to be brought closer or or the Nenter of mass needs to be move closer to the rear wheels. To maximize lift, your aircraft should rest on the ground with the fuselage tilted upward at anywhere up to a 25-27 angle so that the wings will end up tilted back at up to 30. Edit: I made a simple easy plane in career mode that is both stable and cheap: A trick i've used before is to put modular girders on the sides of the fuselage and putting the gear on the bottom of the girders. As you would expect, spaceplanes need wings: they have various shapes and dimensions, and they differ basically in lift rating: you will want to have enough lift to keep your fuselage approximately prograde during your ascent to orbit. Also, lift is usually placed in the middle-to-back of the wing, depending on the shape. LV-N exceeds 75% of its full power at just 7700m altitude on Kerbin. Landing can be trickier for spaceplanes since they are designed for higher speeds than other aircraft and may not be able to fly level at speeds low enough for an easy landing (<50 m/s). 2022 Take-Two Interactive Software, Inc. Clear editor. It is due to the spinning up of the engines. One idea I haven't noticed here yet: "wire up" the landing gear, with strut connectors. You can post now and register later. How do I fix this? But I am still not sure if there are more reasons or perhaps it is just a physics bug which I am wasting my time on. It's a prolem enough I have sever differen gear subassemblies that are stable (un wobbly) I can then position depending on COM. My plane tends to wobble on the runway with the stock game so i decided to download FAR, but the problem still persists. The problem could be due to several issues. If you placed the main wings at the centre of mass and then added the smaller wings behind, this should be correct already. I removed them and it works fine now. I believe the issue is there is not enough control surfaces to offset this issue, but it comes up very easy so it is not a very big deal. As lift increases you remove some strain on the gear, however you've just increased the amount of sag. While having the same stock parts as in the VAB, spaceplane design is obviously quite different from pure rocket design. 2022 Take-Two Interactive Software, Inc. http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/99660-0-25-Adjustable-Landing-Gear-v1-0-4%28doors-fixed%29-Nov-14. However, it's not a matter of "atmosphere or not", just a matter of air pressure which decreases rapidly with altitude. First, I'm sure this is WAY overengineered, but I haven't gotten to the point of caring about that yet. My first test of the plane parts in KSP2.Like and Subscribe for more Kerbal stuffs!#kerbalspaceprogram #ksp2 #kerbalspaceprogram2 #shorts #spaceplane #nasa When landing, you can achieve the highest lift for a given speed by raising the total angle of attack of your wings to 30 degrees (although this induces a great deal of drag). There are several forces in Kerbal Space Program which have an effect on the flight characteristics of SSTO craft. Note that a Wheesley or Goliath engine can reverse its thrust to allow rapid deceleration during landing, but these are not recommended for a spaceplane due to being unreasonably heavy and inducing excessive drag when attempting to transition to orbital velocities. Privacy Policy. Wow, if you need 200 m\s to take off, you should think about adding more lift. However, don't bother going overboard with intakes because your engines will still shut off at high altitudes due to the low air pressure regardless of how many intakes you have. Plane wobble during takeoff - KSP1 Gameplay Questions and Tutorials - Kerbal Space Program Forums Is there a way to place landing gear so that i can guarantee my plane can remain stable on the runway even at high speed in excess of 200m/s? All I have are the parts from the Aerodynamics tech and the gear bay (wheels). When your jet engines stop working, it is time to ignite the old, reliable liquid fuel engine. As long as you're in space, your spaceplane won't differ from any spacecraft: you will probably want to add batteries and generators to prevent the command pod from running out of power. This allows you to takeoff at lower speeds and on shorter runways, and likewise for landing. @TheEnvironmentalist There is one more method I'm sure would work in your case, although I didn't write about it because I think it's cheesy and wouldn't solve the root problem. symmetry building makes them face slightly towards (or away from) each other, with wobbly results. For heavy rockets, it might be required to use structure to space the gears away from the body to allow more pitch. I just thought my planes were too heavy or not enough control surfaces. You should be able to navigate fairly readily, and with the superb efficiency of jet engines, you should have plenty of fuel to go anywhere you need to go. 6.4K Downloads Updated Jun 7, 2017 Created Jun 7, 2017. . This would indicate two problems. So I have played the game for 200 hours and I love it. Besides the good advice others have given, I would also be very careful with that little tailwheel. 3. angle of the wheels. If you pull up and cause the tailwheel etiher to hit the ground if it was already up or push it into the ground if it was still in contact, you will create bounciness. But also check to make sure that your wheels are placed symmetrically and your engines are aligned properly. Keep your spaceplane pointed about 90 degrees above prograde so that the wings and body of your aircraft slow you down as much as possible. If your spaceplane is able to fly and land steadily at low speeds but just you're having difficulty slowing down as you approach the runway, try to reach your desired speed first and then approach the runway in almost level flight. When dealing with high-speed landings, you may touch down too quickly and cause the front of the plane to smack into the runway. You cannot paste images directly. The only drawback to the reduced friction is reduced steering control, so this setting may need to be adjusted when taxiing to/from a runway, but should otherwise be kept minimal for takeoff and landing. All rights reserved. Consider placing your rear landing gears close to the spaceplane's center of mass, but be careful to avoid an engine collision with the runway. Is there a way to rectify this problem. How wide is the base. Pasted as rich text. Also, excessive use of the rudder usually causes the plane to spin out of control and crash. If you have seen the examples above, I have planes that have angled landing gear and they work perfectly, yet some planes with straight landing gears don't. Also avoid the basic fin for the same reason. This is good for spaceplanes operating in low-oxygen atmospheres where jet engines can't be used. Landing is hard. The plane is clearly unstable. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Such as not producing lift, which is not what you want with a plane. Do you have a screenshot of the craft? I have done everything imaginable to try to remedy this problem. As such, you will need various control surfaces. - Have enough lift, either by a big wing area or high speed. For some reason, when the plane is trying to take off and pulling up, the plane begins to bounce on it's front wheels (the back wheel kicks up), whichhinders the plane taking off. To recover the most value from your spaceplane, you should try to land on the runway at the Space Center (this tutorial, although it has been written for spacecraft and not spaceplanes, is a great help). For spaceplanes, avoid the FAT parts (wing, tail fin, and control surface). With a tail-dragger, the plane is already angled up just sitting on its wheels so once the speed is high enough, it should just float up by itself. Description: "Originally called the Cockpit-plus-two, the 5 seat "Cockatoo" is a second-generation command pod that provides both safety and comfort It is rumored to have enough room to pack several days of emergency snack rations and board games" Useful stats: As the description states this large command pod holds 5 kerbals Now I'll walk you through a basic aircraft; fancy stuff like science equipment can be added later. If you can maintain level flight at about 30-40 m/s, you should be able to perform an ocean landing if needed. So the answer is: in the SPH, click on your front gear, set the spring to .5 and set the damper to .5 -- then save it and give it another shot at launching. Although I usually only need 50 m/s for most planes to wobble out of control. my planes keep flipping backwards on take off . How to Fly a Plane - KSP Beginner's Tutorial - YouTube 0:00 / 25:53 How to Fly a Plane - KSP Beginner's Tutorial Mike Aben 30.6K subscribers 78K views 2 years ago KSP - Absolute Beginner's. Upload or insert images from URL. Alternatively, if you're returning from a high orbit or from an interplanetary trip, you can try repeated shallow passes through the atmosphere. Aircraft in this game is almost unfeasible, especially in career mode, you will lose all your money before you finally design an aircraft that can even takeoff. wings, unless they're very well braced). This plane will be able to take off, travel somewhere, perform a crew report, and then land. Here, the. This makes them a very effective choice for SSTOs since they do a good job of getting maximum velocity out of air-breathing mode, and then allow you to use oxidizer without needing the added weight and drag of a separate rocket engine. (However, it must be noted that it is bad practice to use ailerons as elevators since it makes it hard to control the aircraft), The rudder moves the tip of the plane left and right; it is rarely used, since it is hard to put it both up and down due to the possibility of hitting the ground. The Whiplash's ridiculous fuel efficiency allows a spaceplane to climb high into the atmosphere and gain a lot of speed while barely using any fuel at all. Finally you need to make sure it's all balanced, this means the centre of lift marker needs to be very slightly behind the centre of mass marker. If you plan on either dropping off cargo or picking up cargo and traveling with it, you'll generally want to locate your cargo bay at the middle of your center of gravity. Close to empty tanks will allow you to fly slower, decelerate faster, and reduce touchdown strain. Keep your spaceplane pointed about 90 degrees above prograde so that the wings and body of your aircraft slow you down as much as possible. 2022 Take-Two Interactive Software, Inc. It is usually placed back because it can be placed further back than it is possible in the front (if it is placed in the front, it can obstruct the view of the pilot, which is undesired) as well as making the plane unstable (by the same effect that you would get if the center of lift (horizontal lifting surfaces) were in front of the center of mass, but with vertical surfaces). If you keep all of the fuel in the front, you may find that your center of mass drifts backwards as your fuel drains. Safety note: Disable the brakes on the front landing gear. Your link has been automatically embedded. I checked my planes and I found the problem. All of them had one thing in common though. For this to happen, I'm assuming you're using rocket fuel tanks. KSP v.22 Takeoff Troubleshooting Guide/Tutorial Lots of info to help get your plane off the runway! Ideally, the wings should be tilted upward at an angle about 3-5 from the fuselage for optimal lift-to-drag ratio.[1]. KSP Stock Space Shuttle by _ForgeUser18393701. https://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/index.php?/topic/124380-wing-lift-amp-wing-lift-to-drag-ratio-charts/, https://wiki.kerbalspaceprogram.com/index.php?title=Tutorial:_Spaceplane_basics&oldid=100619. Go on, and take the plane capsule which looks like a converted fuel storage device. Let it get good and clear of the ground before applying any control to it. I found biggest cause of this as well as not being able to possibly correct is having sas on during takeoff, make sure that is off during take off and should find problem is less likely to occur, but I too struggle to make working space planes even when center of lift, mass, thrust are all as needed. Bit late i know, but i had the same problem. LV-N "Nerv" nuclear thermal rockets are commonly used on SSTOs for the rocket stage if Rapiers are not used. [KSP 2] I'm trying really hard to make a Mun capable ship but this rocket . 1. tilt of the plane. Tell ya what, I'm gonna try to recreate that thing in my sandbox and see what I get. . Thanks for all the help. Also note that shock cone intakes appear to provide the best air supply at all mach speeds, and unlike other air intakes, they do not decline in performance beyond certain mach speeds. I can not get any aircraft-style spaceplane take off from the runway, they will stay on until the end, where the engines crash into the ground and explode. If you have a very short length of runway remaining and your parachutes can't slow you down fast enough, you'll be forced to cut the chutes and attempt a second landing without them. The centre of mass was between the 2 landing gears. Need to move them up. You probably won't have much luck landing the fuselage intact if your Mk3 plane gets its wings scorched off on reentry. One FL-T100 tank can't power any rocket into space, yet a Shock Cone Intake, a Mk1 Inline Cockpit, a half-filled FL-T100 and a J-X4 "Whiplash" Turbo Ramjet Engine aimed in the general direction of "up" will let you laugh your way past the 70km mark at nearly 1200m/s. If rear landing gear are strutted together, or braced to a center point, they are less likely to torque in different directions. 2022 Take-Two Interactive Software, Inc. To minimize drag, vertical tail fins can be kept minimal, since aircraft can be maneuvered adequately by roll and pitch alone. The issue is my plane rolls very sharply to the left any time I pitch up. - Make sure you have enough control authority to lift the nose up. Descending greater than -10 m/s usually makes a mess. Landing also often requires rapid deceleration to avoid running off the end of the runway or crashing into a slope when landing on open terrain. You're going to have a bad time. Plane spins/lurches to the side during takeoff? Here are a few pictures of it: Take a picture with center of mass and center of lift turned on. If that's not an option, you can still recover some value by landing at any suitable flat place on Kerbin. However it's huge size can make it tricky to take off from the runway without destroying the engine. Unstable Aircraft: "FAR Firehound" (Stock). You can post now and register later. Now for the engines. That will align with the craft axis. This allows you to avoid the extra weight and mass of additional fuselage parts, so you only have to deal with the extra weight of the fuel itself. Be aware that while this angle will provide the lowest possible landing speed for your spaceplane, it will create problems if your center of gravity is too far ahead of your rear landing gears (causing a high-speed nose collision on touchdown) or if your rear landing gears are too far ahead of your engines, causing them to strike the runway first. Just like with rockets, get some courageous Kerbal in the cockpit and let's get started! Another trick is to move the rear landing gear forward, closer to the center of gravity. This aircraft handles smoothly, no matter how you turn, roll and flip this aircraft, it will never lose control. everytime i make a powered plane, it always flips over and points backwards after i take off. Basic structure Firstly you're going to want to make a short fuselage. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. For a Mk1-based aircraft, your rear landing gears should not be tightly tucked together on the fuselage. What you ought to be using is the Swept Wings and Elevon 1s instead of the Delta-Deluxe Winglets. This makes design easier, eliminating all concern for balancing jet fuel against rocket fuel. If you're planning on landing on a somewhat uneven surface, like an open grassland somewhere on Kerbin or an island on Laythe, consider packing some parachutes for deceleration. In fact, nothing will happen at all, and that's probably bad, so put an air intake on your plane anyway. But regardless of that, try very hard to let the plane fly itself off the ground without you applying any controls. Enable mirror symmetry to save yourself some alignment effort. Spaceplanes generally ascend best on a 10-30 degree incline, often leveling out towards higher altitudes to pick up the maximum horizontal velocity before switching to rocket motors. I was wrong. A Mk1 Cockpit, two Mk 1 Liquid Fuel Tanks, and then cap the back with a round nose cone (use the A/D keys to rotate it as necessary). Note that as you fly higher the air intakes will become less effective and you may come to a point when the engines will shut down due to the lack of air. Espaol - Latinoamrica (Spanish - Latin America), http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=484107795, http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=484107807, http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=484107735, http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=484107761, http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=484119427, http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/52080-Basic-Aircraft-Design-Explained-Simply-With-Pictures, http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=484137556, http://images.akamai.steamusercontent.com/ugc/443953434412162923/42B3BB54A6A524CCC2E5C102AD88C8E521790F55/. In subsequent missions, you may want to launch with less fuel to cut down on cost and make landing a quicker and easier process. As you approach 35-50 km, your aircraft will most likely level itself out, at which point you can try aiming about five degrees above the horizon line. They sometimes coincide with ailerons on some, more space-economical, aircraft. All lift-rating means is that the wing section will resist motion perpendicular to its plane. To minimize the risk of such a situation, try to land on a large patch of flat open ground approaching a downhill slope. If you forget to put an air intake on your airplane, don't worry! Go on, and take the plane capsule which looks like a converted fuel storage device Contents 1 Making a fuselage 2 Understanding Lift 3 Control Surfaces 3.1 Elevator 3.2 Aileron 3.3 Rudder 4 Landing gear Making a fuselage Any plane needs speed - so you need thrust (usually). Powered by Invision Community. Your plane is almost finished. This helped immensely and if you haven't been doing this already, do it. Do you have new pics after you moved the rear wheels forward? And, of course, try to take off and land as slow as possible. 2 will usually do nicely, but 3 or 4 are usually better (but of course heavier, and this tutorial assumes you use 2). All trademarks are property of their respective owners in the US and other countries. I've had stability issues in planes where I'd have proper gear setup, balanced weight and lift. I do add a strut to each wheel out of habit since my earlier versions use to roll, better safe than sorry. Now for wings, the "Wing Connector Type B" is the largest you have so far; connect a set of those where the centre of mass is. First of all, since the launch happens horizontally, you will have to include landing gears, and you will most likely want to include jet engines for the first stage for excellent fuel and cost efficiency. Because of how small Kerbin is and how high its gravity is, a perfectly flat surface just north of the equator will cause planes taking off to bias to the right of the runway, as if they were rolling downhill. When you are near the end of the runway, quickly activate then detach them to get the nose pointing up. Increasing the number of intakes will not allow you to continue using your jet engines at higher altitudes. 3. make sure your center of mass is slightly in front of center of lift force. After a successful touchdown, high-speed motion on the runway (let alone uneven ground) can be unstable, causing the aircraft to careen to one side or the other, potentially resulting in loss of a wing and sometimes the entire aircraft. Even if you can takeoff, landing will usually destroy tat aircraft so survival rate on an aircraft for a typical kerbal is nearly zero. To do this, take a few barrels of your jet fuel, stick them on the back of your aircraft. - Make sure the landing gear is as close to the center of gravity as possible, just slightly behind it (for nosewheel aircraft). 2022 Take-Two Interactive Software, Inc. http://kerbalspaceprogram.com/forum/showthread.php/13851-The-woes-of-building-a-space-plane?highlight=woes+spaceplane. Also note that for maximum efficiency, you should make sure that your horizontal control surfaces are rotated to exactly the same pitch that you've rotated your wings. That's over 2x the normal recommended max. Hot ground causes air to rise, cooling as it moves away from the heat, which leads to increased density and a resulting fall back down. To avoid wobble, wheels need to be absolutely vertical, and they shouldn't be attached to something that is likely to flex as speed builds up, as this could also affect the vertical alignment. EDIT: So, I set the front landing gear spring and damper to 0.5, and also set the tail gear spring and damper to 2, and the problem was fixed! i have no idea why this happens please help. Then you want to put something called a "Small Circular Intake" on the front of the tank, and a "J-20 Juno" engine on the back of the tank. This page was last edited on 19 February 2020, at 07:08. DO NOT ANGLE THEM! For more information, please see our http://www.youtube.com/user/Cruzanak?. As you reach 100m/s, hold S to pull the stick back, and you should be in the air! - KSP Matt Lowne 527K subscribers 1.3M views 2 years ago I've wanted. If the problem has to do with lift then travelling very slowly, possibly even slower than that, should counteract the effects of lift and you won't drift nearly as much. Doesnt make sense so just do this: Nope that didn't solve anything, even when the plane is past the runway and gliding on the little bit of space before the ocean it will slowly lower to the ocean, what am I doing wrong? FAR says it would take an Angle of Attack of 24.3 degrees at 119 m/s to generate enough lift to get it to take off. 200 m/s runway stability just doesn't seem to have a worthwhile purpose to me, and is inducing counter productive engineering challenges. That way you can use aerodynamics to lower the tail, rather than trying to raise the nose. Unfortunately, with only these basic parts, landing on the runway won't be easy; a viable alternative is to throttle down to nothing, then belly-flop in the ocean. Note that no wings will tolerate more than 2400K, so the difference in temperature tolerance between Mk2 and Mk3 fuselages isn't terribly significant. Even with a stable landing, you may find that you don't have enough room on your desired landing area to come to a stop before you reach the end. Just after having taken off, the plane will immediately start rolling to the right, and completely uncontrollably. When flying straight the plane is pretty stable but pitching up causes a sharp roll and I cant figure out why. Symmetry placement should give you perfect symmetry, as far as the game is concerned. Wing shapes do not appear to have a significant impact on drag or drag-to-lift ratio at this time, but swept wings are still an easy way to help ensure that your center of lift stays behind your center of mass. You may also want to deploy your landing gears to increase your drag, as well as airbrakes if you have them. T-1 "Dart" engines are unique amongst conventionally-fuelled rocket engines: They have close to the highest efficiency in both vacuum and low atmosphere. I am definitely aware that there are multiple reasons as to why the plane flips. And also place them further apart. Pasted as rich text. All trademarks are property of their respective owners in the US and other countries. I feel tat it is either due to the symmetry placement in this game being inaccurate or certain parts where i anchor my landing gears on are not perfectly symmetrical and the physics calculation is just too sensitive about even the slightest misalignment. Now right click each elevon and the tail fin and set what movement each controls; the ones on the large wings control roll only, the ones on the back wings control pitch only, and the tail fin controls yaw only. After placing wheels I always use the rotate gizmo on snap with absolute orientation. If you've been able to successfully re-enter on previous low orbit test runs, you should be able to use this method to achieve similar rates of success once you've slowed down sufficiently. Subscribe! Obviously jet engines are air-breathing, so you need to include air intakes in your spaceplane. Mods needed for this aircraft to work: Procedural wings, Adjustable Landing Gear, FAR. Display as a link instead, Vice versa a plane with lots of control surfaces will be perfectly controllable (maybe even too much) but may have big difficulties with taking off and landing at reasonable speeds. Depending on which surface you place them on, they might not be parallel to the axis in which case. Note: This is ONLY to be used to report spam, advertising, and problematic (harassment, fighting, or rude) posts. This can easily cause you to crash on landing. * Gear not mounted to parts that will flex (e.g. Heavy transport seaplane inspired to the Soviet Beriev A-40 Albatros which also appears in Evangelion 2.0! Controllability of a plane is on you. 4. Here's a quick installment in to the. When your spaceplane rolls shortly after touchdown, veers to one side and then explodes on the runway, you have a problem with landing stability. That said, parachutes are an exceedingly effective means of reducing your stopping distance. It's strongly recommended to keep your landing gears well-spaced from each other to ensure that the aircraft will be difficult to roll into a collision. These have extremely poor temperature tolerance and will almost inevitably break up during atmospheric reentry. https://wiki.kerbalspaceprogram.com/index.php?title=Tutorial:_Your_First_Plane&oldid=103052. Espaol - Latinoamrica (Spanish - Latin America), http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/65638-Basic-Airplane-Space-Plane-Aero-Tutorial. My plane usually take off at a little over 120m/s. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten, or redistributed. However, they are extremely heavy for their power, weighing as much as a conventional rocket nearly 11 times more powerful. I am accelerating it to over 200m/s on the runway just to test the stability of those wheels since the faster you go, the more likely the plane will wobble and flip on the runway. I was attaining high speeds on the runway without getting off the ground, which made the plane yaw back and forth.